Calling All Christians For Advice

Maxwell B (@spadoincle) 8 years, 9 months ago

If suicide wasn’t a sin then wouldn’t every devout christian want to die as soon as possible? Or stop being a christian so they can feel motivated to live?

“we cannot solve the significant problems we face at the same level of thinking we were at when we created them.”-Albert Einstein

February 10, 2013 at 11:06 am
Conner J. (1,558) (@connerj93) 8 years, 9 months ago ago

@spadoincle, In my opinion, Christianity is a corrupt religion to follow. Not because the Bible is fraudulent, or because God doesn’t exist, but because the leaders who enact the will of the religion are corrupt. I love the message of Christianity and all other religions however, nowadays there is no integrity in the churches’ practice. Religion tells you what to do, spirituality you already know what to do by choice. To feel motivated to live, realize your own motivation to live, do not succumb to external motivation. It is my belief that all religions state the same thing, hold the same truth, it’s just the mistranslation that’s causing the unrest.

Please read a few of these pages, they explain a lot.
http://www.truthcontest.com/entries/the-present-with-religion/

The idea that suicide is a sin is not just bound to Christianity. I follow no religion but practice spirituality heavily and i’ve come to the realization that death is being transitioned to unconditional love. I’ve wanted to kill myself hundreds of times, though I always find myself in love with life. However, no being on this planet had a choice to be born, therefore no being on this planet should have a choice to take their life away. I’m not trying to tell you what you should do, i’m just giving my stance as you asked.

“If death just meant walking off stage to change your character and costume, would you slow down or speed up?”

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Anonymous (2,833) (@) 8 years, 9 months ago ago

@spadoincle, but it is a sin…

Are you trying to rationalize christianity?

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Mark (16) (@mfowler73) 8 years, 9 months ago ago

If you haven’t found salvation while living (assuming that is the answer you’re looking for) why would you find it after death? What would change, because after all you’d still be “you.” A Christian’s motivation does not come from seeking answers (having faith) but rather being assured in salvation. Martin Luther said hell, purgatory, and heaven seem to be no different than fear, doubt, and assurance of salvation.

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Nikolaj Katballe (12) (@niko2210) 8 years, 9 months ago ago

Every christian has an obligation to enlighten others of the truth he has discovered. Christ should shine through every christian an in that way, christians should be good examples to others – showing kindness, love, etc. In that way, the christian shows others what his faith has done to his life.

Anyway, suicide isn’t a shortcut to heaven. Evryone will go to heaven at the same time on the day of judgement. Suicide just mean that you spend more time in your grave. In a biblical perspective at least. :)

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Anonymous (119) (@) 8 years, 9 months ago ago

I have no interest in Religion; just the viewpoints and ideals that they have to offer. Why study from one when you can learn from all? I remain an atheist and I believe in spirituality.

However, @spadoincle , you bring up a very valid point. This ideology surely reflects how flawed some religions are in their astute beliefs…

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Zocrates (0) (@efren) 8 years, 9 months ago ago

@spadoincle I don’t think I understand your question. Yes suicide is a sin but why would Christians want to die as soon as possible?

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Anonymous (177) (@) 8 years, 9 months ago ago

@spadoincle, unanswerable :0)

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Bryan Hellard (307)M (@xyver) 8 years, 9 months ago ago

@efren, Because there is a life full of perfection waiting for them after they die. No sadness, no anger, only happiness and love. Wouldn’t people who truly believe in an afterlife like that want to die ASAP so they can experience it ASAP?

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Another flaw in Christianity!?!? You don’t say…

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OnAnotherLevel (5) (@onanotherlevel) 8 years, 9 months ago ago

@spadoincle, Yes and no. I guess I should start by saying I am christian and I don’t want to kill myself. This is kind of hard for me to explain without typing an essay but I will try my best. I believe in the afterlife and that I will be able to truly be my spiritual self and all the worries of this world will no longer matter. Although I believe they don’t matter right now anyway. However they are still here and after having some spiritual highs and receiving little of what the afterlife is like, I wouldn’t be sad or scared to leave this world. But I want to stay here so I can grow in every way possible and learn as much as possible about the universe and myself. I believe in the afterlife, we continue to grow to perfection so this life is for me to enjoy and to prepare myself for the afterlife. As for the second question, believing all this motivates me to live even more.

Side note. I think the problem with Christianity is that its institutionalized. It was never supposed to be. But spirituality is true and the world we live in is not what life is supposed to be.

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Being_Scott_Embry (24) (@honeyeater) 8 years, 9 months ago ago

@connerj93, Ah huh! My daily bible

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Almeida (304) (@xetado) 8 years, 9 months ago ago

If you’re really happy you won’t want to kill yourself. Be sure of that.

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Arbin Dobbs (3) (@inoeverythingbecauseinonothing) 8 years, 9 months ago ago

I am a firm believer in the trinity. I love the aspect of going to heaven and realize what a wonderful place it is. But one must realized everything is made by God, and He made us in his image. We a very lucky to be able to experience the emotions and reality of this world. I look at is as being born into an eternity, instead of not having to worry like children do when they are young in this current world, we worry about answers and soon are introduced to God and his faith through jesus. Remember we have our own personal relationship with jesus and we get there through the hardships and miracles in our life. With your love from your faith you should share this with everyone through your personality and perseverance in life. Instead of committing suicide try making a difference for Gods creations and all of you know to be true.

Matthew 5:16

“Let your light so shine before men, that they may see your good works, and glorify your Father which is in heaven.”

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Ray Butler (1,423)M (@trek79) 8 years, 9 months ago ago

@spadoincle, The flaw is in common interpretation. This is a good point, why would you want to suffer on Earth if you can accend to heaven and live in bliss? But that is not what the Bible really teaches, just a bunch of dumbasses decided that is what they will take from it.

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Ray Butler (1,423)M (@trek79) 8 years, 9 months ago ago

@spadoincle, If you are interested in what my take is on what the Bible teaches about death see https://www.highexistence.com/topic/hell-is-reincarnation/

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Ray Butler (1,423)M (@trek79) 8 years, 9 months ago ago

The point is: It takes work to not only build the ideal situation but it takes work to adapt to it, both of those things are what life is about.

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Anonymous (177) (@) 8 years, 9 months ago ago

@inoeverythingbecauseinonothing, you are jesus and god and jesus and god are you – no such thing as either in any sense of being outside or separate from you – tread softly regarding concepts taught by institutional christianity and look only to the words of jesus (he does not talk about church – did not send his disciples to seminary before sending them out, did not invent sunday school, did not tell anyone to build churches) – go with what you were born with, not what you picked-up from anyone/anything outside of yourself – you were created in the image of god – so you were/are already there when you entered this world – why would there be anything out there that one needs to learn or be saved by?

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Maxwell B (24) (@spadoincle) 8 years, 9 months ago ago

@connerj93, @ijesuschrist, @mfowler73, @niko2210, @generaltitsvonchodehoffen, @trek79, @rickyferdon, @xetado, @honeyeater, @onanotherlevel, @aestheticbrah,

it came up in conversation last week and i just got around to putting it on HE. What u have to think about is the fact that when you believe in a God and an afterlife and follow a text that describes these things then you end up living the life you know is real with the afterlife you have faith is real in mind. You life your life with your afterlife being a major influence. So that is how the question came up. If it wasnt a sin to commit suicide then wouldnt you see a lot less christians? either because they chose to go to the afterlife they know is real and be with God or they end up having an existential crisis in their head and probably end up valuing life more than afterlife (which in my opinion is a much more humanistic viewpoint on life).

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chrisdimitrios (0) (@chrisdimitrios) 8 years, 9 months ago ago

@spadoincle, Great thinking. I agree at an ignorant level, a devout Christian would think this way. I use the word ignorant with good intentions. I once upon a time thought similar to you however not around suicide. My thoughts: ‘When someone dies, why do we morn? Doesnt this mean that they have gone to heaven? (On a completely different topic i believe people morn for two reasons, 1. Selfishness, 2. Doubt of the afterlife). Moving on. . . It is important to note that I have never contemplated suicide. Killing yourself does not end a life, it ends pain. There are more positive strategies to ending pain! I was born a Christian however I am now proudly an amalgamation of all religions, philosophies and sciences. My advice to any Christian is to let their rational though guide them to the truth. (God in christianity gave you this beautiful gift). Although i agree with some of the above comments around the discrepencies of Christianity as a whole, I do however belief that bible is perfect if you interpret it correctly and flush out the garbage that was placed their to feed ego. It teaches us that a virtuous life is to be humble! Do not be selfish!! Be selfless!!! If a christian killed himself to get to heaven quicker, then that would be considered selfish. Now rationalise on this thought; Does heaven house selfishness? ‘Hell’ no. Oh and ps. one of the largest misinterpretations in Christian belief (in my opinion) is that the devil and hell exists. I believe hell is earth, and we do go to “hell”/earth (again) as when we are not ready. So basically a devout Christian who kills himself for a head start gets disqualified and has to start all over again.

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Anonymous (2,833) (@) 8 years, 9 months ago ago

@spadoincle, But it IS a sin, so I don’t see the point of this…

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Conner J. (1,558) (@connerj93) 8 years, 9 months ago ago

@spadoincle, What u have to think about is the fact that when you believe in a God and an afterlife and follow a text that describes these things then you end up living the life you know is real with the afterlife you have faith is real in mind.”

Solid point, and it’s always wonderful to be concerned with our long term future and beyond. However, there comes a point when while following any religion where you adapt completely to a pre-determined pattern of behavior or thinking and are thrown down a path already laid out before you that may or may not lead you to a good place. It seems nobody knows how to live nor die in my opinion, nobody fully understands what existence means because there’s nothing, literally, to compare it to, therefore we do not know what non-existence means either. We all came into this world blind, appealing to what other, time tested, establishments seem to appeal to our own personal way of thinking and how we see the world. And we will leave with whatever belief system we carry, though in terms of a manic depressive suicidal person, their belief system is gone. That is why its considered a sin, it can be fixed and should be fixed. Now I know there are the people who believe what’s after is better than what’s before, myself included, but there’s a tendency to love life and see it through till the end, just as you said. To go to hell you must first choose to do so, the choice of that being; committing suicide.

If you ever read the research being done on OBEs and NDEs, you will find multiple stories and accounts of a self-judging life review, or your life flashing before your eyes. These people will describe that they felt every time they made someone feel good, and every time they made someone feel bad. They state that if you kill yourself you will go to hell, morally by choice and your own judgement, because it is the greatest harm one could ever commit on their lives. It lies in the fundamental construction of our moral aspect of life since birth. It’s one of those things that cannot really be answered, though infinite number of clues are to be found.

And to be humanistic, you must view life and death as one inseperable act of nature.

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Maxwell B (24) (@spadoincle) 8 years, 9 months ago ago

I asked Christians to reply to this specifically because yall are the ones who live your life with your afterlife in mind. I cannot say the same. My motivation in life comes from the fact that I will eventually face my mortality (so NO, I dont want to fucking kill myself. I mean @ijesuschrist haha). I am not concerned with what happens after death. Yet that is what nearly half our species (3.1 billion) is wholeheartedly OBSESSED with. And I gotta say, with the way our species destroys itself and everything it inhabits, it is damn near despicable that we haven’t changed our way of thinking yet. Well over half the human population thinks man is born out of sin. What if the whole world KNEW that man is a blank slate from birth (with species specific exceptions of course) and that we make our own society in our own image as we see fit using the rules NATURE uses, not some pathetic attempt by man to rewrite them as fantastical dogma; that will always end in extinction.
We certainly wouldn’t be making weapons of mass destruction if we followed natures rules. we would be making tools for mass collaboration. We need to change. That is why I put my Einstein quote in the original statement. We cant keep thinking this way. It will destroy everything that the universe has took billions of years to create. Ecological atmospheric balance DOES NOT take seven days to form.
A lot of people just walk away from getting chewed out like this. Who wants to sit and listen to somebody telling you that the way you make decisions is completely off wack and out of tune? It is so easy to say “well you can believe what you want to believe and I can believe what I want to believe and the world will keep turning.” Yeah? Thats all fine and dandy until sea levels rise 13 feet and half the population is GONE. Who do you think is gonna fix the problems we have created? It certainly wont be the one’s with their hands in a bind talking to themselves waiting for ascension into non-reality land.
WE ARE HUMANS. and because we have altered this world we are now responsible for it. The oldest text written by man talks about this for Gilgamesh sakes. How should we think about that responsibility? Should we believe in a God that tells us we are born bad and the earth is inevitably going to burn, but sit tight and be blindly obedient and you will get your VIP pass away from the flames? Or should we say WE ARE IN CONTROL AND WE BETTER START DOING SOMETHING DIFFERENT OR WE WILL FACE OUR MORTALITY SOONER THAN WE EVER WANTED.

@connerj93, @mfowler73, @niko2210, @aestheticbrah, @efren, @rickyferdon,

I urge all of you to read this whole thread and look at the diversity of answers. @chrisdimitrios. @inoeverythingbecauseinonothing, @xetado, @honeyeater,

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Ray Butler (1,423)M (@trek79) 8 years, 9 months ago ago

@spadoincle, No, we are not really in control, that is a popular misconception. We are capable of function, actions that can cause other functions of the universe to benfit us, but that is not control, it is like gravity; we are falling but we pull our rip cord so that the parachute deploys, we are still decending because we do not control gravity, we have just used our skills to avoid that gravity from being fatal.
Kind of like we do not create the water that sources the river but we can dam the river, manipulation is not control, manipulation is to interfere with what is controlled. We do not write the laws of physics, that would be control, we only understand those laws and use those principles to advantage.

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Anonymous (177) (@) 8 years, 9 months ago ago

Ha! If we’re in control then watch us stop the next hurricane, tornado or earthquake.

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Alex (345) (@staylucky) 8 years, 9 months ago ago

Asking Christians for advice is like asking Christians for advice.

I was trying to think of a funny analogy but it turns out it’s probably already the best..

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