One thing you believe

Anonymous (@) 9 years, 7 months ago

I want to get a general idea what and why people believe the things they do. Tell me about one particular belief you hold (about anything: God, life, death, science, the supernatural, aliens, anything) and a brief explaination of why you believe it. Please be respectful and don’t tell me what you don’t believe (that is, don’t put words in the mouths of people whose ideas are different from your own). My thanks to all who participate

June 11, 2012 at 10:55 pm
DaJetPlane (994)M (@lytning91) 9 years, 7 months ago ago

@haileyj, I believe that there is an absolute which governs us relative beings. I think we try to define this absolute as God or a Deity, or maybe as science, but in the end I don’t think that relative beings can imagine an absolute for what it truly is, even if it is staring us right in the face.

We are relative creatures in an absolute world. It is this thought that insures a higher power/authority exists which can see the world for what it really is.

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DaJetPlane (994)M (@lytning91) 9 years, 7 months ago ago

@haileyj, Also, great discussion. I sat for a good 10-15 minutes before I finally got something I felt I really wanted to convey

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Anonymous (170) (@) 9 years, 7 months ago ago

@haileyj, I believe everthing is in a state of flux, this is based solely on observation.

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James (38) (@tanner) 9 years, 7 months ago ago

@haileyj, Very nice topic :). I believe that the primary goal of the Universe is growth and evolution. So the more you feed that universal goal by for example expanding the awarenss of others, or doing something previously im possible, the more success you will have. I believe the purpose of karma is to steer you in the direction of evolution by dropping the lessons you need to learn into your life.

I belive this because I see it in the human race. We need growth. We’ve been constantly evolving and creating new tools since our creation. And the people who have boosted growth the most are held above others as an example. (Einstein, Beethoven, Da Vinci, Michael Jackson, Tyson, Jordan, take your pick)

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Lanard (4) (@KLCT) 9 years, 7 months ago ago

@haileyj I believe that everything big(universe), small(particles), concrete(lol concrete), and abstract(thoughts, feelings, etc..) all exist within everything and all in one order. Lately I’ve been reading this book called The Holographic Universe and it explains the similarities between a hologram and our world. It describes how all of the information of a hologram projected off holographic film is contained throughout the entire film. In short you can cut the film in half, fourths, eighths, etc and the image projected will still be whole instead of projected as pieces. Tons of examples are given in the book. My favorite is how some people can dream about people they’ve never met before(like an ancestor) or a place they have never been before but be extremely accurate in their description. Personally I think all of the knowledge of the future, past, and existence in general is somewhere deep in our consciousness(or unconsciousness) and due to time, conditioning, survival, etc.. most of us have lost the ability to access the deeper more subtle levels where all that information is kept.

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Rodrigo Mendes (20) (@lemminkainen) 9 years, 7 months ago ago

I believe in supernatural and aliens because of astral travel (main reason but not the only for sure)… and then in God. Nice post lady.

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I believe love is good.

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Dan (890) (@danfontaine) 9 years, 7 months ago ago

I am God manifest in the form of man. My unadulterated will is the will of God. Truth is contained in my skull. Through knowing and discipline I can soar to levels I can’t yet fathom. My destiny if I meet it, is to guide the flowering of life on this planet.

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SumtinProphetic (4,925) (@sumtinprophetic) 9 years, 7 months ago ago

I believe all humans want to be happy and no one wants to suffer. I believe that becaaaauuuuse…. argue against it!

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daveb (119) (@daveb) 9 years, 7 months ago ago

@haileyj,

I believe I am responsible for the obstacles and problems in my life. That belief gives me the power to either overcome an obstacle or to accept it gracefully. Traffic jams are a great example – I can either exit the freeway and find an alternate route, or sit peacefully until it clears.

thanks for creating such a cool topic!!

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Ray Butler (1,423)M (@trek79) 9 years, 7 months ago ago

As far as the material world is concerned, I believe in science, cause and effect. We think a dream is not real, yet it does exist otherwise we would not have it, so to me the universe is far more than just this material fact of science with cause and effect, more than the sum of its parts.
But I do not believe in good and evil outside of creative and conceptual uses of them, values are artificial in the form of a nihilistic outlook. I just created this saying “For a virgin to be born, a virgin must be destroyed” in this process we asign the devil to one part and God to the other part, but where is that line? It does not exist; the creation is possible only for the destruction, it is the same thing only with its purity defiled by our valuing of it, and that is where evil exists.

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Th-0m (43) (@0negative) 9 years, 7 months ago ago

I don’t believe in anything. There’s too many reasons to explain why I don’t believe in anything, but the main reason, is because I don’t really think “we exist”. That kind of nulls any reason for me to believe in any creed, value, religion, or honor system. Ironically enough, my non-belief is a belief. Paradox.

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The_truth_is_ (91) (@sirensetmefree) 9 years, 7 months ago ago

@haileyj,

I believe in solely the material world and the power of science to uncover the truth about the world we live in.

Why? Because any and all other things are based solely on speculation and experience (which, in and of itself, holds no real value in argumentation).

@0negative,

“my non-belief is a belief. Paradox.”

Nop.

It’s like having desires of other desires. For example, you can DESIRE a doughnut, but you can also DESIRE to NOT DESIRE a doughnut. That’s not a paradox. That is just a desire of a desire, or second-order desire (in technical terms, that is called a higher-order volition).

Similarly, you have a second-order belief (a belief about beliefs). Those are not paradoxes because they do not address the same things.

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philipstcroix (1) (@philipstcroix) 9 years, 7 months ago ago

I do not believe in any supernatural events or entities (I’m a devout atheist ) I believe all events can be explained by laws of nature, such as gravity, the Fermi exclusion principle, and in the existence of higher dimensions (string theory) I believe that gravitational force produced by “dark matter” is proof of parallel universes who lie near us in the fifth dimension, and that it is invisible because photons can’t travel interdimensionally but that gravitons (gravity waves) can. Therefore, we feel the pull, but cannot see the matter. Mind blowing? Great post btw

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Ray Butler (1,423)M (@trek79) 9 years, 7 months ago ago

@sirensetmefree, In my opinion, the best thing about humans is not science or the material world we exist in, but the dream, the imagination. With it we become sentient, science is but a step in that process.
Science is not the apex of existence but the means to the apex of existence. As I have stated in the vegetarian thread, if life is the apex of existence then why would it progress beyond life? We are sentient, we are emotional beings that are capable of conceptual thought. If this is the apex of existence, I do not know, but I do know it is at least the next step toward the apex of existence, the goal of energy, the goal of consciousness.
So to say there is no inherent value in any aspect aside from science is a complete falicy. Aliens, for example of my point, may come for science but they will stay for our creativity, our dreams and imaginations. The arts of humanity are completely unique whereas any science here can be re-created anywhere. Art is far superior to science because it is more than the sum of its parts, science is those parts.

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philipstcroix (1) (@philipstcroix) 9 years, 7 months ago ago

Very insightful! I completely agree @trek79,

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The_truth_is_ (91) (@sirensetmefree) 9 years, 7 months ago ago

@trek79,

“but the dream, the imagination. With it we become sentient,” I don’t see how that follows.

“if life is the apex of existence then why would it progress beyond life?” That just doesn’t make sense. If something is DEFINED as the apex, then it literally can’t go beyond that, and you’re assuming the conclusion in the premise. If you DON’T define it as the apex, then the question becomes superfluous.

“the goal of energy, the goal of consciousness.” Could you define these goals? And define what you mean by consciousness. I have yet to find an accurate definition of consciousness.

“Aliens, for example of my point, may come for science but they will stay for our creativity, our dreams and imaginations.” I’ve never heard this argument before. But I would argue, any creature with the intelligence and technology to come to our planet would view us in the way we view monkeys: they would present the brightest of our species to their scientists in the way that we present a monkey on stage when it learns minor sign language. Which is signs.

“The arts of humanity are completely unique ” Firstly, there’s no evidence for this. You’ve never met any species with the capabilities for arts, so if it exists, you don’t know what their art is like. It could be EXACTLY like ours. If the multiverse theory is true, then there DO exist exact copies of our art, and it is NOT unique, let alone “completely” unique.

Secondly, there’s no evidence that the art would be significantly different! If anything, there’s much more to suggest that alien species would be alike in many respects. Natural selection is non-random, and, therefore, likely to keep alive the same traits that it has kept alive so far in other planets, if they are also carbon-based lifeforms. If that’s the case, then things like art would also be consistent, because our mentalities (as a result of our physical mind) would survive, as well.

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Em (473) (@emily) 9 years, 7 months ago ago

That we’re all made of the same stuff. No matter how fucked up you think someone is, or what a sadistic psychopath this or that person is….you’re made of the same stuff… and we’re all part of a larger whole. (We’re all one)

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1.61803399 (247) (@drunkmonkmeth) 9 years, 7 months ago ago

i believe that everything considered wrong with the human race is perfectly normal and that we really aren’t that much different from the other creatures on the planet.

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Ray Butler (1,423)M (@trek79) 9 years, 7 months ago ago

@sirensetmefree, 1) “but the dream, the imagination. With it we become sentient,” I don’t see how that follows.
Sentience can be defined as an emotional being that displays conceptual thought, conceptual thought can be described as imagined.
2) Yes, I was saying that life is not the apex of existence, specifically because it did progress beyond the simplest of life.
3) The goal of energy and the goal of consciousness is the same goal as that of matter and life; this apex that I have mensioned. Where that apex is I do not know, perhaps it is sentience, in which case it is accomplished, but perhaps it is something beyond sentience, I do not know.
4) If aliens have any understanding of emotive passion then they absolutely will be spell bound by our art, why wouldn’t they? We have interest in cave paintings, we have interest in the Illiad, only if aliens are devoid of emotion would they ignore our art, but I would argue that if they indeed do not understand emotion then they would be all the more perplexed by it.
5) Until there is evidence that there is exact duplications of our art then our art is unique because that is what defines unique. Sure there maybe alien art fundamentally similar to ours but it would not be exact. You argue with a hyperthetical example of parralell universes to dispute the uniqueness of our art, you are an idiot.
6) If our art is very similar to aliens, they would be fascinated, if it is completely different to that art of aliens they would be fascinated, if aliens do not have art at all they would be fascinated by our art. No matter how you look at it, aliens would be fascinated by our art, as we theirs. If you do not see why then you do not understand what art is.

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Ray Butler (1,423)M (@trek79) 9 years, 7 months ago ago

@sirensetmefree, Sorry, I retract the “idiot” statement, you have a good point, but really. Hyperthetically, if our universe is infinitely large then there are infinite Earths with infinite variations on this, as there are infinite exact duplicates of Earth, we do not need multiverses or parralell universes for there to be every possibility. But that is a completely different discussion.

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The_truth_is_ (91) (@sirensetmefree) 9 years, 7 months ago ago

@trek79,

1) That’s a very broad definition of conceptual thought that is missing quite a bit if you just describe it as “imagined.” Also, if those are your definition of each, then they come simultaneously, not as a result of one or the other. So, still, you can’t “become sentient,” with something, because that would imply that such a thing came before the sentience, in order to have that sort of causal effect that you’re describing. And, again, I don’t see how that could possibly follow.

2) The development of biological forms from simple to complex doesn’t mean anything towards the concept of “life,” as in the existence of life. Not to mention that, in the grand scheme of things, life has just begun. Life could be the apex, we’re just too egoistic and keep measuring things by our own experience and not the universes.

3) Consciousness is something that has yet to be defined, so to give that a goal doesn’t really mean anything. Energy cannot have a goal. That requires consciousness, in which case it wouldn’t be the goal of energy, it’d be the goal of consciousness. And, again, you’d run into the problem of not being able to define consciousness. The only thing I can think of as a “goal” is entropy, which says nothing interesting and can be entirely material and doesn’t require any consciousness, let alone a goal to that consciousness.

4) “We have interest in cave paintings, we have interest in the Illiad,” Yes, and we are interested when animals do something that is similar to art, too. But if a creature is as far advanced as to be able to traverse space-time (maybe even hyper-space) in such a way that they can visit us, what makes you think those things would be novel to them? What makes you think they’d view our way of communication any different to how we view the communication of dolphins? They wouldn’t. Hawking, deGrasse Tyson, Dawkins, among others, all believe aliens would treat us like underdeveloped, under-evolved animals if they saw us. Why? Because of what is required for them to travel to us. You’re giving this uniqueness to the human experience as if aliens would by pass all of those developments and somehow get flying, space-traveling equipment out of nowhere. No, that’s not how development works.

5) Hypothetical? So you’ve never heard of the multiverse theory? That’s actually a very prevalent theory right now in the world of physics. As for the absence of evidence, that’s called an appeal to ignorance. What you’ve said is a word-for-word example of a logical fallacy. It’s a sign of someone who doesn’t know how to reason. http://www.fallacyfiles.org/ignorant.html

6) Again, that has nothing to do with what I’m saying. What I’m saying is that, if a creature exists that is SO HIGHLY developed, emotionally, physically, and technologically, that it can reach us, our art would be to them what monkeys using sign language would be to us.

An “idiot” wouldn’t resort to logical fallacies, like ad ignorantium or ad hominem, or straw man. They are prevalent in your work and show a lack of more thorough critical thought.

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Ray Butler (1,423)M (@trek79) 9 years, 7 months ago ago

@sirensetmefree, Maybe 2% of people would know what the hell you are talking about, what makes a genius is not someone who can out think everyone else but someone who has the courtesy to communicate to others according to their means, that is what I do. Prevailing theories, Hawkins and stuff like that is duchebaggery, created for egos, you call me egotistical, and I am but you need to check yours.
Yes, for anything to have a goal it must have consciousness, but as consciousness is not defined, how can you say it is not a fundamental property of the universe, more so than energy? A lot of what I have said is conceptual, I will admit that, but in true objective reasoning, can you say I am wrong? That is your falicy, that you think I have no grounds for my statements but I have as much grounds as you do to refute them.
If you notice I have used things like “I believe” and “could be” last I checked, these are not absolutes. You are simply on a mission to define yourself, good for you.

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Michelle (17) (@adiaphora) 9 years, 7 months ago ago

I believe that everything consists of energy, and that like attracts like. And I believe that things aren’t necessarily ‘good’ or ‘bad’ (good vs. evil). I believe that everything has positive and negative qualities positive and negative- something, or the lack of something. Neither is better than the other, they’re both equally important to balance each other.
I’ve come to this conclusion from a lot of other people’s theories and my own, as well as my experiences.

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Ray Butler (1,423)M (@trek79) 9 years, 7 months ago ago

@sirensetmefree, Have you ever touched a concept? It is a thought, an idea, something conceived in the mind, if you create something physical from it, that physical thing is not a concept. The difference between theories and the actual, maybe you should look up the definitions.

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