Sound & Math

 Nick (@iloveyou)7 years, 11 months ago

Good Evening.
I was curious to how you HEthens feel about the topic of math, more specifically sacred geometry, and sound. A topic I’ve been interested in lately is using sound (or vibrational frequencies) for a purpose other then entertainment as we find in it today. Upon looking around the web I found Cymatics (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cymatics), and Solfeggio frequencies (http://www.redicecreations.com/specialreports/2006/01jan/solfeggio.html).

Cymatics is interesting in how shapes form from the vibrations of certain frequencies. The shapes it makes is considered to be apart of sacred geometry like the Fibonacci sequence or phi. It made me wonder how certain frequencies can affect humans, or living organisms in general. To anyone whose ever heard of binaural beats, ( if 300 Hz was played in one ear and 310 in the other, then the binaural beat would have a frequency of 10 Hz. Some more info at; http://online.liebertpub.com/doi/abs/10.1089/acm.2006.6196 ) you see the effects it can induce. Can music on the radio or from a musician we like effect the way we feel, think, or act?

Another thought this brought up was more specific to how frequencies may effect us. A ‘conspiracy theory’ I’ve read a bit about was a person using a device that could act like a dog whistle but to humans, and the whistle has more or so of an effect than just driving us crazy from a high pitched sound. You can research different subjects on it like ‘ELF’ if interested. Not all sound vibrations/frequencies can be used just our selves, but towards the outside world as well. As in cymatics, what if it’s used on a bigger scale?

I have a professor who was talking about tibetan monks chanting together in harmony and using the vibrations within the sound to move heavy objects. With a search on google of ‘Acoustic Levitation’ you can find videos and documents, scientifically backed or DIY experiments, of this in action. Take it to an amplified level and moving heavy objects via sound seems possible. Can ancient structures been constructed this way?
Whatever the use may be, sound seems to play an important role in life.

What opinions do you hold between the relationship of sacred geometry and sound?
Is there anything you’ve learned about one of these two topics that convince you that there is something great about these subjects, or that it’s all just hooplah?
I’m interested in what you all have to say and think about this.
Thank you & have a stupendous day.

October 24, 2013 at 10:19 pm
Rose (30) (@roseara) 7 years, 10 months ago ago

@iloveyou, hey, this is the first time I had heard of solfeggio frequencies. I don’t know much about the relation bw sacred geometry and sound, but since I glimpsed at the article you’ve linked, i’ve started listening to frequencies and there’s got to be something to it, some kind of truth behind it, some kind of connection. It calmed me down completely, even my muscles relaxed afterwards. I was writing when I was listening, and my handwriting became very clear and ‘orderly’ if you will. I could even hear myself breahe, and began taking full breaths bc it was uncomfortable not to. Bizarre.

Anyhow, I wanted to say thanks.

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Nick (12) (@iloveyou) 7 years, 10 months ago ago

@roseara, I’m glad it could help. Whether it was for chants and instruments played by the indigenous of the Americas, Africa, Europe, Asia, or Australia they all seemed to have a purpose for music other for it just sounding good. It’s very amazing to me that music can have such effects on the mind. It’s like when I listen to hard rock I get pumped up, or when I’m sad I’ll listen to a song of such melodies, etc. I never gave it much thought before then of why the music would do that.
I hope it continues to have a positive effect on you the more you check it out and get into it.

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Rose (30) (@roseara) 7 years, 10 months ago ago

@iloveyou, yeah, you can be completely vulnerable to it.
Thanks, I think I’m going to make it a daily occurrence, since it had such a good effect. The vibration of the sound just feels natural, you know? It doesn’t distract or change the nature or line of your thinking/thought process. It just gets into you. It feels so good, especially in comparison to other musical techniques.and it’s simply a vibration. You listen to the same vibration for an hour. It’s not a song, not a symphony, not a beat, simply a vibration. Oh yeah.

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JonH (1,139)C (@IJesusChrist) 7 years, 10 months ago ago

My personal opinion is that the reason that music (without lyrics) and provoke emotion is that it is expressing the sound of how we would speak in the experienced emotion.

For instance the way one says a certain thing will evoke a certain (different) emotion. It will be very difficult to fully explain this in typing, but if I were to say to you I love you in a matter-of-fact way, very little emotion is actually evoked, although it may be triggered logically. How the words themselves sound do nothing.

However, if I were to string some words together, all of which are well-assembled and thoughtful such as “I woke this morning to find you next to me, the most beautiful thing in the world, and behold, I knew that I loved you.”

Before you even know what I’m going to say, you know what I’m going to say based on the tone and pitch I’m using. This is the sound, or the music, of voice, and it will amplify, if not create on its own, an emotion with your words.

If however, you use the same pitch and tone to describe something very mundane its funny, it doesn’t make sense. Because you still feel this emotional response to the sound, but the logic (the words) don’t make sense!

I’ve only recently noticed this, and I’m still developing it in my head, but most music I hear today, especially pop-music, has a sound that evokes a strong emotional response. The funniest thing is, though, is that often in pop music the lyrics and the sound are not always made by the same person, and you can tell. Often they just try and fit the words to the music. This makes me greatly detest pop music, for the sound itself is wonderful (or horrible) but its layered over a logical sequence (the words) that aren’t made by the same mind! Thus I can’t enjoy it.

Its quite rare to get a musician or band that is fully incorporating both sound and lyrics in the same song. Not one, then the other. If both are created coherently and simultaneously, the music is much more profound. Thats why most of my music is without words, just instrumental, its much easier to find good music that way.

Lastly, some sounds will obviously evoke a different emotional response. Hence sometimes we do listen to a song and think “the lyrics don’t make sense to the music” or “I wish they would have said THIS instead of THAT”. As we all grow and change under different environments, the sounds, words, and phrases we hear are going to be different.

Anyway, thats my thoughts.

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Anonymous (2,654) (@) 7 years, 10 months ago ago

I don’t know anything about that.

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Nick (12) (@iloveyou) 7 years, 10 months ago ago

@roseara, Right on. In my opinion vibrations are all around us. Some of the first we heard were that of our mothers while we sat in the womb. If you don’t mind, let me know if you start noticing any differences within your thought process, or mood from listening to these daily. I’m interested in how it effects people other than my self.

@ijesuschrist, I agree with you on the tone of voice has a big effect. If I’m not mistaken it’s like saying something in a sarcastic tone. As for pop music, it’s weird you say that because something that really sparked this thought was a pop song called ‘Too Close’. From what I’ve heard, pop or not, it can be easy most of the time to hear how the words don’t really fit with the beat. It could just be our preference, but I know what you mean. Thank you for your opinion! It helps with the more and more I look into this.

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Manimal (2,998) (@manimal) 7 years, 10 months ago ago

@iloveyou, “The shapes it makes is considered to be apart of sacred geometry like the Fibonacci sequence or phi.”

-It seems you have misunderstood the concept, sacred geometry is not about particular numbers.

“you see the effects it can induce.”

-The claimed effects of binaural beats aren’t really proven. The power of suggestion is immense. One thing that is proven though, is that binaural beats can induce seizures on some people.
Not hating, I use (and make) binaural beats sometimes and get some results, but I doubt that they really came from the beats.

“Can music on the radio or from a musician we like effect the way we feel, think, or act? ”

-Well, yeah. Of course it can, that’s why people like it. Different intervals, tempos and so on convey different moods and “soundscapes.”
Ever wonder why almost all huge disco and house songs play at 127-130 bpm? Because that tempo range makes people wanna get up and jack (and it syncs fairly well with the average person’s heart beats.)
Ever wonder why most metal songs use the same intervals? It’s because those intervals are the most aggressive-sounding ones.
Ever wonder why the tritonus interval is banned in church music? Because people back in the day thought it sounded evil.
Ever wonder why most music is either 4/4 or 3/4 and not 7/9 or 12/17? It’s because we somehow percieve 3/4 and 4/4 as more smooth and continuous and catchy.

A tiger’s roar stuns its prey due to a sub-sonic frequency (infrasound) that triggers a reaction in their nervous system.
These same frequencies have been found to make some people depressed.
At a famous “haunted” catacomb in Britain, an old fan was found to be what was giving people the creeps, due to it producing sound at that same frequency; when they replaced the fan the “hauntings” stopped.

“I’ve read a bit about was a person using a device that could act like a dog whistle but to humans”

-These things are used a lot these days actually, usually in shops, I’m not really sure why but I remember that the reason wasn’t scientifically backed. Some people can hear these signals, but most can’t. I can hear them, and they’re very annoying.

“you can find videos and documents, scientifically backed or DIY experiments, of this in action.”

-These sorts of theories are always interesting, but in the end they never add up. If such fantastic methods were known and used back in the day, why would people have just stopped using them completely? Why would we be struggling with inferior tools and methods?
As for the scientific backing, that’s what all far-out theorists claim, but that’s a misuse of the word “scientific.” Pseudo-science is not evidence.

“What opinions do you hold between the relationship of sacred geometry and sound?”

-Sound is nothing but vibrations. Frequencies are represented as numbers, sound can be considered mathematical. “Sacred geometry” does not apply, but “sacred mathematics” does (the former being a sub of the latter.)

“Is there anything you’ve learned about one of these two topics that convince you that there is something great about these subjects, or that it’s all just hooplah?”

-Yep. Many small bits that accumulate.
However, most of the stuff people claim is nothing but hooplah.

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Charlotte (51) (@11mothernature) 7 years, 10 months ago ago

This is my favorite subject.
there are 12 pitch classes in modern western music, and it is said that the universe itself is a dodecahedron.
There is the sacred interval of a fifth, if you play a C and a G on the piano they hit in a way that divides the smoothest. Used in divine music… we have 5 fingers and five toes. and when we spread our arms and legs it makes a pentagon.
Music is giving time a reference point that we can assess? And I think we gain imagery from music from the intervals that are in relation. Both space and time are important. What notes to use and when to use them.
Music therapy is a very interesting field that you should look more into. It’s all about creating a desired change in a person using music as a tool.

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Rose (30) (@roseara) 7 years, 10 months ago ago

@iloveyou, hey, I’ve used the frequency almost every day since. I need to stretch everyday, and I put on a frequency whilst doing that. Firstly, there’s a concentration which occurs naturally. Things don’t normally hold my attention for long, and I usually desire being in 6 different places in the duration of a day, everyday, whilst being completely alert, with the most transparent, clean and unaffected by bullshit energy. This is not happening. But I continue trying. But this frequency will completely calm me down and I can just feel this space in my body. There’s something in relation to space. I feel space between my feelings and myself, between my plans and myself, between time and myself, and then I want what’s simply good for me and my body afterwards. It feels really good. Not in a pleasurable way, or a double edged sword kind of way. Just, in a child like way, almost. Without the idealism. There’s something really sexy about it.

How is it for you?

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Nick (12) (@iloveyou) 7 years, 10 months ago ago

@roseara, When you feel able to calm down/concentrate, is it a certain frequency or multiple? With the feeling of space, are things more clear upon thinking/outlook on life? I like how you describe it, it sounds like a state of meditation in a way.

I haven’t been doing it every day like I’d planned, but it has produced a calming effect towards me. I get really dazed sometimes, where I want or say something and I will dislike what I did or said an hour or more later. With being able to calm down and take it easy, I’m able to not feel as shitty towards my actions and their results. Whether it’s the mindset I have towards these tones or what they produce for each person uniquely, they play a beautiful part in my life. I’ve done more research and reading upon sound and I see a constant connection between space, words (sound), and light.

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Rose (30) (@roseara) 7 years, 10 months ago ago

@iloveyou, I use the 528 Hz, that’s the one I love best. Apparently it’s the ‘love frequency’, would you believe? To be honest, I don’t think, not during. And it doesn’t change my outlook on life. I genuinely, simply enjoy it. I enjoy not thinking without telling myself to not think, ya know? And I just stretch, which is even better, because oxygen travels through my body better, and I can feel it. So it’s like pleasure for the mind and pleasure for the body. Sometimes, I’ll keep going for an hour. You don’t even realise it. Feels so good.

It’s something I look forward to because it’s good for me and my body used to be terribly tense. But there’s something about this particular frequency I genuinely love. I dont know what it is. It simply inspires this good feeling within.

Anyhow, excuse the amateur description. Just finished work and the soles of my feet are throbbing.

You have a mindset towards the frequencies? What is it?

Mmmm, I love all 3 of those things. Light, space and sound. In that order. The first two are close together, the third is a little further off for me.

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Nick (12) (@iloveyou) 7 years, 10 months ago ago

@roseara, I wouldn’t doubt it. Whatever the reason may be, I believe that each person will favor a certain frequency more than others. Of course this isn’t true for everyone, just my opinion. Whether it’s because the frequency helps repair and soothe a persons experiences, or just because it rings more pleasurable.

Wow, I should try that. Your ‘amateur’ description gave me a thought to listen to a frequency while doing yoga. I think I’m going to try this tonight :). Thank you for the idea! To have something that makes you feel good and be able to look forward to it with such pleasure, it’s quite beautiful.

The mindset I hold towards the frequencies is that they do have a power to them. Just as I believe crystals hold a power to them. It’s like how if you keep seeing negative or focusing on it, that’s what you’ll keep seeing/experiencing for the most part. If you don’t mind me asking, what do you mean by space is a bit further off for you? Like in a pun type of way, or the experiences you’ve had with light & sound being more blissful than with space?

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Rose (30) (@roseara) 7 years, 10 months ago ago

@iloveyou, yeah, they definitely have an effect. It’s not a placebo effect either.

Nah, I said sound is 3rd for me. Not a pun. Space and light are almost always in my mind. Light is great and space is awe inspiring. Like, if I look at a table, I won’t see the table, ill just see that it’s able to exist in this space, and im stunned by that. But, it makes me very ‘spacey’ to be that way, so am changing that now. Like, sound exists in space, it vibrates in space and for some reason, that piece of info turns me on, so damn much!

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Nick (12) (@iloveyou) 7 years, 10 months ago ago

@roseara, My mistake, I misread that. I think I get what you mean. I used to see everything as just there, now things exist in a way where they are physically in the space but come out so differently. I started noticing it more and more, it’s hard to explain, but to me it’s like its there without really ‘being’ there. A too real dream. Haha, I can see that being a turn on. People are turned on by weirder things. It’s taking a step back, looking at how beautiful & well constructed this life is and experiencing a vibration of blissfulness.

It’s one day that I aim; to stumble across the right vibration sending me off by light, into space.

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Rose (30) (@roseara) 7 years, 10 months ago ago

@iloveyou All the best, Nick.

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sian (109) (@siantastic) 7 years, 10 months ago ago

@ijesuschrist, I like to call my cats terrible things in my usual loving tone. It keeps me entertained and as far as they’re concerned I’m still being nice :D

@iloveyou, I sometimes use binaural beats. And they work well for me. I’ve even used them for migraine relief. However I’m still not entirely sure of the legitimacy of the idea. I accept it could be placebo. But that doesn’t diminish the power of them.

@manimal, @iloveyou, yeah they have those high pitched devices round here. It is a pitch aimed at younger ears. It’s sole purpose is to ‘deter youths’. Hahaha, it’s so fucked.

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josephm (772) (@josephm) 7 years, 10 months ago ago

there is a strong correlation between sacred geometry and revolutionary sound scape’s imho

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